Thestrals -- The theme of death in Harry Potter

[vegablack]

Can Voldemort see Thestrals? He fears and hates death. Does that mean he understands it or is his denial a sign that he is ignorant of it?

[dancingpony]

I would say "yes." In order to see Thestrals, one must have witnessed death. I don't think one's feelings about the death(s), or about death in general, would be relevant. Besides which, the fact that Voldemort feared his own death doesn't mean that he was ignorant or uninformed about death in general -- that he didn't understand what death meant. (Can you picture him being brought to trial, had he been arrested rather than killed in the final battle. "Ladies and Gentlemen of the jury, my client can't be held responsible for the murders he has committed. He has no understanding of death . . . . ")
Voldemort definitely had witnessed death by the time he was a fairly young man -- he might even have been present at the death of his mother, when he was an infant. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he was able to see the Thestrals when he first showed up at Hogwarts.

[queenie]

Dancingpony, I must respectfully disagree with your last statement. Riddle was present at the death of his mother, but he had no idea what was going on, in much the same way that Harry had no idea what was happening when his mother was murdered in front of him, therefore, he couldn't see thestrals when he first arrived at Hogwarts.

However, Harry's life had been very cloistered at a young age in a way that Riddle's wasn't, by which I mean, Riddle had a lot more people around him, all the time, than Harry did. It's possible that a child at the orphanage might have died young - from something like leukemia or any number of noncontagious things - and that Riddle may have watched, and that may have caused him to see Thestrals.

But, now that I think of it, I can imagine young Riddle maybe hiding up in his room while other children were saying their last goodbyes to the poor soul. Now I'm wondering if, when/if Riddle meets a Dementor, he flashes back to his mother's death. Trouble is, there isn't anything to hear, unless he heard the talk of the nurses around him.

[vegablack]

I believe that infectious childhood illness would have been prevalent in an orphanage in the period Riddle was there. Polio, Scarlet Fever, measles, Diptheria all would have been common diseases of children of the time and Scarlet Fever and Diptheria would have been particularly deadly. So it is likely that some children died in the orphanage at the time he was there.

So he may have seen death before he went to Hogwarts. Doesn't seeing Thestrals involve more than seeing a corpse, but also the understanding of death. "Seeing" it as it really is. Could Voldemort do that?

[dancingpony]

Looking at what I wrote, I can see that I didn't make my thoughts clear at all.

When I said I wouldn't be surprised if Voldemort had been able to see Thestrals when he first showed up at Hogwarts, I was thinking more of his years in the orphanage than the death of his mother. From the description of his time there, it seems that he was already a cruel, and probably a violent, person even at a young age. So it wouldn't surprise me to learn he had witnessed death while fairly young but old enough to understand the concept.

I don't really picture him hiding in his room while another child died at the orphanage. He certainly feared the idea of his own death -- but I don't see any evidence that anyone else's death would have bothered him. In fact, he seems to have been the sadistic type who would have enjoyed someone else's fear and death.

[vegablack]

Yes, in the books he certainly killed without compunction and watched other people's deaths without any empathy or concern for the dying.

He hated death only for himself and by using the Dark Mark advertised the threat of death for other people. Even the name Death Eaters, has a double meaning. He escapes Death himself but inflicts it on others.